What's not good about a new GI Bill? (Trees And Things)

migtex: Re: What's not good about a new GI Bill?

Sat, 15 Nov 2008 12:09:04 EST

* TOTALLY ELIMINATES ANY POSSIBILITY FOR VOCATIONAL SCHOOLS ETC. 4 YEARS COLLEGES - FORCED THE ELIMINATION OF ALL VOCATIONAL SCHOOLS. GREED OF 4 YEARS INSTITUTIONS - ELIMINATED ANY CHOICES FOR GI EXCEPT THE 4 YEARS COLLEGES - - WHICH HAVE A BLO

logan: Re: Not Enough Jobs?

Fri, 2 May 2008 17:50:28 EST

There's a funny thing about the way America handles skilled-labor resident aliens: we do it in the worst way possible. When someone comes to America on a student visa to learn medicine, engineering, computer science or whathave you, the INS is very clear:

joshv: Re: Not Enough Jobs?

Tue, 22 Apr 2008 05:48:47 EST

I will agree, we are artificially depressing demand (and wages) by importing workers. The wages paid to H1Bs are actually pretty much illegal - they are supposed to be paid market rates - but everybody knows they aren't. What would be the point

logan: Not Enough Jobs?

Mon, 21 Apr 2008 20:14:24 EST

Yes, but there are not enough jobs in the high paying fields to support all of the college students.

Really? Then why am I surrounded by Indian and Chinese engineers on H-1B Visas?

The truth is that at least in tech there are enough jobs but

thefadd: Re: What's not good about a new GI Bill?

Mon, 21 Apr 2008 14:37:42 EST

Dude, I'm totally quitting my job to go sell bathroom fixtures.

postillion: Re: What's not good about a new GI Bill?

Mon, 21 Apr 2008 09:55:16 EST

I think the demand is there for education, and I think that even if the overall amount of student loans was lowered, the same number of students would/could go if the overall cost of education was lowered, and the focus was placed on education and

pO157: Re: What's not good about a new GI Bill?

Mon, 21 Apr 2008 08:35:49 EST
I have a good friend who wants to return to college because he thinks he's not recognized enough as a translator because of a lack of degree. I keep telling him it's because he's not spending enough time sending his material out there to be publi

postillion: Re: What's not good about a new GI Bill?

Sun, 20 Apr 2008 23:54:22 EST
why at age like 50* or something is a good idea and will turn their life into a magical utopia with sugarplums dancing in the sky and money growing on trees.
Ironically, it's only by going to college and getting a degree at a considerable expense

postillion: Re: What's not good about a new GI Bill?

Sun, 20 Apr 2008 23:43:29 EST
But carpenters, plumbers and auto mechanics frequently still make solid middle-class to slightly above incomes (not going to say upper middle class but certainly above the middle class mean).
I know someone who sells supplies for bathrooms (sinks

PenitenziAgite: Re: Could you teach me, or would you have to charg

Sun, 20 Apr 2008 22:51:25 EST
And then some

pO157: Could you teach me, or would you have to charge?

Sun, 20 Apr 2008 10:12:31 EST
Some of the young whippersnappers ran circles around me there, but I drank all their milkshakes in other areas
So, what you are saying is your milkshake brought all the MBAs to the yard?

PenitenziAgite: Re: What's not good about a new GI Bill?

Sat, 19 Apr 2008 21:20:47 EST
No doubt. My MBA coursework was so much easier than anything I had in college, with the exception of Accounting and Finance, which was tough mainly because it was all new to me. Some of the young whippersnappers ran circles around me there, but

JimmyHavok: Re: What's not good about a new GI Bill?

Fri, 18 Apr 2008 18:48:35 EST
I've been a TA or teaching my own classes now for three years, and I've come to realize that you can't expect (and indeed, nobody really expects) that more than about 10% of your class will actually do the assigned readings, on time. You can sort

postillion: Re: Re-Twaddle

Fri, 18 Apr 2008 15:48:55 EST
And economists say the change in manufacturing, albeit painful, is healthy for the sector and for the overall economy in the long run.
Oh, I don't doubt that there are many people who think that a decline in manufacturing "employment" (Is it that

zyxwvutsr: Re-Twaddle

Fri, 18 Apr 2008 13:43:03 EST

The decline of U.S. manufacturing has long been studied by sociologists studying poverty in the U.S
No, the decline of US manufacturing employment has been studied by sociologists. US manufacturing is studied by

port1080: Re: What's not good about a new GI Bill?

Fri, 18 Apr 2008 11:33:28 EST
But it's not just dorms and cafeterias. Again, my Alma Mater as an example, they built a massive amount of new square footage that had zero impact on education. They had to do it because if they didn't have the new chemistry labs, admissions

joshv: Re: What's not good about a new GI Bill?

Fri, 18 Apr 2008 11:22:50 EST
But it's not just dorms and cafeterias. Again, my Alma Mater as an example, they built a massive amount of new square footage that had zero impact on education. They had to do it because if they didn't have the new chemistry labs, admissions wo

port1080: Re: What's not good about a new GI Bill?

Fri, 18 Apr 2008 11:01:13 EST
I'd argue that this is really part of a classic bubble economy in education.

I see where you're going on this but I'm not sure if I would call it a bubble, exactly. Or at least, not a bubble in education...it's more a bubble in "ed

joshv: Re: What's not good about a new GI Bill?

Fri, 18 Apr 2008 10:24:05 EST
"The big problem is that colleges have started to move away from their core mission of educating students towards a "Club-Med for Twenty-Somethings" style where they try to compete for students by offering useless amenities like world class gymnasiums, gou

uncarved block: Food For Thought

Fri, 18 Apr 2008 09:41:18 EST
It will be repeating past comments, but I think any discussion of the American class system has to take into account that part of status is the number of people you answer to at work, and the pay is only part of it. Why the marked (and remark

pO157: Re: What's not good about a new GI Bill?

Fri, 18 Apr 2008 08:56:55 EST
How about going to a numerical percentage based grading scale. Most grade reports list an "A" as excellent or outstanding. If 70% of the class has an "A" due to Vietnam era grade inflation, then it is not really "Outstanding" is it?
However, that would

port1080: Re: What's not good about a new GI Bill?

Fri, 18 Apr 2008 08:13:19 EST
The big problem is that colleges have started to move away from their core mission of educating students towards a "Club-Med for Twenty-Somethings" style where they try to compete for students by offering useless amenities like world class gymnasiums, gour

pO157: Re: What's not good about a new GI Bill?

Fri, 18 Apr 2008 07:05:03 EST
The reason why so many people are going to college is not because vocational training in high school has been wiped out; it's because becoming middle class in America is now about working in companies that requires degrees.
Meanwhile, many of t

Lou: Re: GI William

Fri, 18 Apr 2008 07:00:47 EST
Accident

zyxwvutsr: GI William

Fri, 18 Apr 2008 06:47:58 EST
Why did you downmod my informative comment?! You dick!

JimmyHavok: Re: What's not good about a new GI Bill?

Fri, 18 Apr 2008 03:18:32 EST
Moi aussi.

thefadd: Re: What's not good about a new GI Bill?

Fri, 18 Apr 2008 00:22:43 EST
But carpenters, plumbers and auto mechanics frequently still make solid middle-class to slightly above incomes (not going to say upper middle class but certainly above the middle class mean). These jobs can be landed through vocational education that requi

Lou: Re: What's not good about a new GI Bill?

Thu, 17 Apr 2008 22:49:49 EST
and you think this is funny why?

postillion: Re: Twaddle

Thu, 17 Apr 2008 21:45:16 EST
Just about as much is manufactured in the US today as in the past. So what the hell are you talking about?
Fifty years ago, a third of U.S. employees worked in factories, making everything from clothing to lipstick to cars. Today, a little more t

zyxwvutsr: Re: What's not good about a new GI Bill?

Thu, 17 Apr 2008 21:15:23 EST

Student loans will be the next domino to fall in the current credit crunch
Ho ho!

zyxwvutsr: Re: Twaddle

Thu, 17 Apr 2008 21:11:54 EST

The increasing corporatization of the U.S. has decimated many of the traditional routes to middle class without a higher degree
What does that mean? That there are more corporations today than before? What has that got to do

postillion: Re: What's not good about a new GI Bill?

Thu, 17 Apr 2008 21:04:59 EST
Frankly, I think most of the people who go to college shouldn't be going, regardless of the costs. They'd be better served by vocational training in high school (which in the US has been utterly eviscerated).
The reason why so many people

thefadd: Re: What's not good about a new GI Bill?

Thu, 17 Apr 2008 16:47:47 EST
I have to say, one of my two management courses in college was extremely helpful in the workplace. It happened to be the one I got a C in because I scored an A on all the tests and projects while skipping every class of the second half of the semester. The

PenitenziAgite: Re: What's not good about a new GI Bill?

Thu, 17 Apr 2008 16:29:46 EST
College is not a specifically a job training program. College, especially for those who study humanities or social sciences, is about learning to think and express ideas. A degree in History or Philosophy is not 'worthless' if the person is abl

pO157: Re: Tangent

Thu, 17 Apr 2008 13:39:02 EST
Did it have anything to do with the country being awash in cheap BA/BS degrees that don't mean squat and as such the value of a college degree is not what it used to be?

thefadd: Re: What's not good about a new GI Bill?

Thu, 17 Apr 2008 13:21:44 EST
A few people crashing on the rocks chasing the siren's song is what ensures the highest concentration of talent for our corporate workforce. A few more ensures depressed wages. Since I posted that bit about Fromm's editorial, I've been looking for it on th

thefadd: Re: What's not good about a new GI Bill?

Thu, 17 Apr 2008 13:15:23 EST
Steve Martin majored in philosophy.

thefadd: Re: What's not good about a new GI Bill?

Thu, 17 Apr 2008 13:14:44 EST
Being down with students loans 6 months from now - $928
BA in History - priceless
he he ;-)

thefadd: Tangent

Thu, 17 Apr 2008 12:35:49 EST
I heard an interesting piece by David Fromme yesterday about the dwindling returns of taking our loans to pay for a bachelors degree.

joshv: Re: What's not good about a new GI Bill?

Thu, 17 Apr 2008 10:53:51 EST
Yes, but there are not enough jobs in the high paying fields to support all of the college students. Frankly, I think most of the people who go to college shouldn't be going, regardless of the costs. They'd be better served by vocational traini

pO157: Re: What's not good about a new GI Bill?

Thu, 17 Apr 2008 10:09:41 EST
If you don't have the cash, the interest on your loans could easily send you into an almost permanent state of penury, inescapable even via bankruptcy - better hope your BA in History will help you snag that high paying corporate job.
Most coll

joshv: Re: What's not good about a new GI Bill?

Thu, 17 Apr 2008 09:56:51 EST
The problem with using public funds to send GIs to school is that current tuition costs are way, way out of line with anything remotely representing reality. Mark my words, the next big bubble to pop will be higher education in the US. They've

pO157: Re: What's not good about a new GI Bill?

Thu, 17 Apr 2008 06:59:30 EST
Don't we owe veterans more than what's currently on offer?
What we owe veterans and current soldiers is a promise that we won't go sending them abroad in some horrendous disaster of an overseas adventure.
Anyway, if you look at the financial