Etcetera

Putting the Cons Back in Condoms

pO157.

Posted to Etcetera on Thu Aug 31, 2006 at 06:56:19 AM EST. RSS.

California sent a bill to Gov. Schwarzenegger that would allow public health groups and non-profits to deliver condoms to inmates in prison. This was prompted in an effort to cut the cases of HIV in prison and thereby reduce treatment costs in the long-run.

It has been noted that the rate of homosexual activity in prisons is high (pdf doc) and often done in secrecy, making it difficult to gauge (although some reports, mentioned in the first article estimate it as high as 30 to 60%). In 2003, California's Department of Corrections spent $18+ Million on HIV care for inmates, but little on prevention.

While public health officials, scientists, and other have called for increased access to clean needles and condoms to stem the spread of HIV and diseases, changes have been slow going -- other nations have proposed allowing conjugal visits instead of condoms in prison, and only a few (Australia, Canada, parts of Latin America, and some European countries) actually allow condom distribution.

AB 1677 (pdf), changes this and allows non-profits to distribute the prophylactic devices to inmates in a manner that will not interfere with Corrections Officer's safety and well-being. This bill, if enacted, will put California's prison system on the same page as other correctional systems in New York City, Los Angeles, San Francisco, Philadelphia and the District of Columbia.

Tags: written by pO157, Schwarzenegger, prison, condoms, jail, sex (all tags)

This story: 24 comments (4 from subqueue)
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1

Tch

BAYANI98.

Thu Aug 31, 2006 at 10:49:12 AM EST

5.00 (astute)

If they're really serious about preventing HIV in prison, they should stop prison rape...

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Re: Tch

coquito.

Thu Aug 31, 2006 at 11:36:03 AM EST

5.00 (astute)

That's easy enough. We'll just lock them all in an individual cell, give them their meals in their rooms, and only let them out for fresh air or exercise one at a time. Hell, why waste time, just kill them all already.

Yes, prison rape is a problem. Yes, it can probably be made less pervasive. But what can actually be done to eliminate it? How much less pervasive can we really make it? You have a bunch of men who don't mind breaking the law in a building, by themselves, together. No women, no way to watch them 24 hours a day -- how exactly are you supposed to keep prison rape from occurring?

Now with caps!

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Re: Tch

dzetetes.

Thu Aug 31, 2006 at 06:06:21 PM EST

5.00 (astute, astute, brilliant)

But what can actually be done to eliminate it? How much less pervasive can we really make it?

Screen and separate prisoners at a high risk for victimization (young, gay/effeminate, physically weak, nonviolent) from prisoners who are likely to rape (violent offenders, sex crime convicts).  

Stamp out the practice among some prison guards to use prisoner-on-prisoner violence (usually meaning rape) to control unruly prisoners.  Start aggressively prosecuting guards who encourage rape or turn a blind eye to it and stiffen penalties for such behaviors considerably.

Offer genuine protective custody for prisoners who have been victimized, and offer them prompt medical care, including a rape kit, and a way of reporting rapes that circumvents having to report it to the guards...who are often the ones who didn't bother stopping it in the first place.

Aggressively investigate allegations of rape, and prosecute prison rapists.  Penalties could include a serious loss of privileges and/or confinement to solitary for the rest of their sentence in addition to further time.

Change the culture.  Help people to understand prison rape as a tragic crime, instead of talk show joke fodder.  When making light of prison rape is as distasteful as making light of a woman being raped in a dark alley, we will have made some progress.  Help people see the injustice of a prisoner receiving an unadjudicated death sentence from HIV acquired during a prison rape.  Help people understand the pain, shame, and rage that victims of rape feel are no less worthy of empathy because the victim is a prisoner.  If nothing else, help people understand that when victims emerge from prison infected with Hep C or HIV or who knows what else, society will often bear the burden of their treatment.

Probably the biggest thing that can be done to eliminate prison rape, however, is for people like you to change your mind, coquito.  Cynically positing the inevitability of prison rape isn't really much different from wholesale acceptance of the practice when it could be made the rare exception rather than the rule, as it is in some prisons and among some types of prisoner.

The city is the soul magnified, after all, and changing the culture, and all of the specific ways that prison rape could be reduced, start with you.  Fully realizing the extent to which prison rape (or any rape) is an affront to human dignity is a start, but its not enough.  The willingness to do something about it must follow.  It's probably not the victims themselves, many of whom are felons and cannot even vote, who are going to be able to start holding the system accountable.  It's us.  

In regione caecorum, rex est luscus.

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Re: Tch

coquito.

Thu Aug 31, 2006 at 08:54:51 PM EST

none

I appreciate the response. I'm glad someone posted some concrete ideas about how to deal with this. I know I sounded a bit cynical, but mostly I was put off by the initial post I was responding to which didn't make any suggestions on how to deal with the problem, just tossed it out there off hand as though stopping prison rape would be the easiest thing ever (that's a little rhetorical hyperbole on my part ;). It would be, I think, massively difficult. Moreso without concrete, practical steps that could be implemented in order to get it done.

Now with caps!

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Hmmm

BAYANI98.

Fri Sep 01, 2006 at 11:30:33 PM EST

none

Now here's a suggestion, supply them with these instead.

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How indeed?

Lou.

Thu Aug 31, 2006 at 04:04:16 PM EST

4.50 (funny, funny)

how exactly are you supposed to keep prison rape from occurring?

Butt plugs?

It's the end of the world as we know it, and I feel fine

4

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Re: Tch

nmiguy.

Thu Aug 31, 2006 at 01:59:19 PM EST

1.00 (funny)

Drug all the prisoners so they canot get erections.  Add the drug to their meals.  If they can't get it stiff, they cannot rape.  As far as their rights, fuck em.  They lose a certain amount of their rights in prison.  And then they are prevented from committing rape crimes.

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Re: Tch

cloudofdust.

Thu Aug 31, 2006 at 03:28:30 PM EST

5.00 (brilliant)

If they can't get it stiff, they cannot rape.  

1. nmiguy's never heard of fisting.

As far as their rights, fuck em.

2. Always nice to see support for the rule of law.

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Re: Tch

nmiguy.

Fri Sep 01, 2006 at 07:52:38 AM EST

1.00 (funny)

Yeah I have heard of fisting.  But really, if the guy isn't going to get off, then he will probably be disinclined to something as foul as fisting.  

Cloud, I am not saying they lose all their rights, but being in prison is literally giving up some of them.  Their liberty has been taken away because of their crimes.  Prison is not meant to be a carnival, or a party.  If sex is disallowed and prevented, and if cons are given a chemical that prevents erections, your are protecting law and order, the other cons, preventing the transmission of disease.  It is charity that convicts don't deserve to give them the freedom to a sex life in prison.  Prison rape can be stopped.  My way would work.  

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Re: Tch

cloudofdust.

Fri Sep 01, 2006 at 08:11:08 AM EST

none

Rape is about power and domination as much or more than it's about "getting off". Your way doesn't address that at all.

And another thing, how are you planning to administer drugs to thousands of prisoners who don't want to take them? What kind of manpower is it going to take to restrain and forcibly inject all these guys? I really don't think you've thought this through.

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Re: Tch

nmiguy.

Fri Sep 01, 2006 at 11:37:49 AM EST

1.00 (funny, funny)

Cloud, what better way to take away a man's power and willingness to dominate than taking away his erection?  
Also, I am not talking about forcing drugs into unwilling bodies.  I am saying you put it in their food.  They have to eat.   They don't have to know about the secret ingredient.  

Sure enough, the sick criminal minds will find ways to exert power and to dominate others, they just won't be able to do it with rape and it will reduce the amount of AIDS and HIV transmission.  

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Re: Tch

cloudofdust.

Fri Sep 01, 2006 at 12:17:29 PM EST

none

Cloud, what better way to take away a man's power and willingness to dominate than taking away his erection?

You want to take away prisoner's power and willingness to dominate? Let's build rape rooms in every prison. Let's build rape machines and have every prison mechanically violated at least once a week. That should get the job done.

I am saying you put it in their food. They have to eat. They don't have to know about the secret ingredient.

I stand by my assertion that you haven't thought this through. Depo Provera is usually administered by injection.

From the Wikipedia article on chemical castration:

Large doses are required to be effective in men. Most men will receive 400mg to 500mg per week, equal to 2.5 ml in each buttock. In some cases, men given oral doses as high as 700 mg/day have still reported regular sexual arousal and fantasies.

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Re: Tch

stevetherobot.

Fri Sep 01, 2006 at 12:58:35 PM EST

none

The side effects could cause this to be a less than optimal solution.

The use of Depo-Provera can cause several side effects including weight gain, fatigue, thromboembolism, malaise, hypertension, mild depression, hypoglycemia and rare changes in liver enzymes.

The use of tamoxifen in men may result in headaches, nausea and/or vomiting, skin rash, impotence, or a decrease in sexual interest. Weight loss has also been reported in men due to reversal of the bloating effect of excess estrogen caused by fluid retention.

In addition to ethical concerns, chemical castration may increase blood pressure in males, sometimes to dangerous levels. Other side effects, such as the formation of abnormal fat deposits in the liver, are being investigated.

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Re: Tch

nmiguy.

Fri Sep 01, 2006 at 01:40:46 PM EST

1.00 (funny)

The use of Depo-Provera can cause several side effects including weight gain,
The use of tamoxifen in men may result in weight loss.

There you go, you give them both and then they'll be fine.  ;)

Yes teh idea of chemical castration is obviously controversial.  But do the benefits outweigh the risks?  Make a study of how prison rape has affected the health of inmates.  High blood pressure is the least of their problems.  Rape has physical effects as well as moral and social effects in prison that are unacceptable.  HIV, AIDS, hepatitis and other diseases are rampant.  Not to mention severe injuries incurred and psychological damage incurred by rape.  A lot of prisoners, given a choice between having some high blood pressure (treatable condition) or having their butt holes ripped open and injected with AIDS would probably choose the former.  

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Re: Tch

Travis Bickle.

Fri Sep 01, 2006 at 09:06:28 PM EST

4.00

"Yes teh idea of chemical castration is obviously controversial."

Do tell, and why would that be, I wonder?  Could it anything to do with the fact that, even in the cases of convicted sex offenders, chemical castration is generally only offered as an option and only when it is to be administered under strict medical conditions?

But, here you're not really calling for that.  Here you're calling for a regimen of chemical castration for the entire population of every state and federal prison in the country.  All because you think your way will work.  And what makes you so sure?  You think chemically emasculating someone is going to make them a docile individual?  Or did you think, side effects aside, prisoners finding themselves being neutered against their will might not just turn a bit nastier and more violent as a result?  And where will you get the doctors and nurses to inject the prisoners regularly enough to have your desired effect?  And out of what pot of money do you propose pulling the money to pay for the chemicals needed to do this?

Sorry, but this is just another of your half thought through notions.

You talkin' to me?

5

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Re: Tch

coquito.

Thu Aug 31, 2006 at 02:17:33 PM EST

none

I take it you're also in favor of taking away their cable TV access? ;)

P.S. - what do they do on conjugal visits?

Now with caps!

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Re: Tch

nmiguy.

Fri Sep 01, 2006 at 07:47:55 AM EST

none

Nah TV is fine.  If the cons are being good.  Of course if they act up, you can take away the TV.

As far as "conjugal visits" hasn't anyone ever heard of talking anymore?   Chemical castration is a safety issue.  It provides discipline and order in the prison.   If the con can't get hard, they won't be raping their cell mate.  

7

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Re: Tch

maml.

Thu Aug 31, 2006 at 02:39:33 PM EST

4.50 (astute, astute)

Not all sex in prison is rape.

...Dwayne was hoping that he would pay exactly the right amount of attention to Francine's clitoris.

11

Re: Putting the Cons Back in Condoms

Shadarr.

Thu Aug 31, 2006 at 07:22:53 PM EST

4.66 (astute, astute, astute)

Call me cynical, but I suspect a prison rapist with AIDS isn't going to use a condom.

--
Bite the hand.

6

Lube, they need lube too

maml.

Thu Aug 31, 2006 at 02:39:12 PM EST

4.50 (astute, astute)

For christ's sake, I hope they get lube too.  Condoms tearing apart from too much friction don't do a hell of a lot of good.

...Dwayne was hoping that he would pay exactly the right amount of attention to Francine's clitoris.

3

Makes Perfect Sense

keta.

Thu Aug 31, 2006 at 12:52:36 PM EST

none

As someone who seldom hesitates to castigate governments and politicians for numbnut behaviour, I can only applaud what I see as a sensible measure.

That, and it's always fun to watch the fundies wet themselves.

This story: 24 comments (4 from subqueue)
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