Legal

Europe's Schengen Zone Expands

novy.

Posted to Legal on Wed Dec 26, 2007 at 10:15:05 AM EST (promoted by port1080). RSS.

When you cross from one Canadian province to another, or from one American state to another, you run into signs that say, e.g., "Welcome to Alberta" or "Welcome to Oregon" and you just continue driving. But if you cross national borders, you run into customs checkpoints where armed guards can insist on checking your papers or going through your possessions for contraband. Unless you travel in continental Europe between countries that participate in Schengen Agreement, which permits passage between member countries without border controls.

That Agreement provided for common policies on temporary entry of persons (including "Schengen Visa"), harmonisation of external border controls, and cross-border police cooperation. By Treaty of Amsterdam, that Agreement and all decisions enacted in connection with it have become European Union law. All Union members and three non-members (Norway, Iceland, and Switzerland) have signed up, but until 20 December only 15 nations had actually implemented it (namely Austria, Belgium, Denmark, Finland, France, Germany, Iceland, Italy, Greece, Luxembourg, Netherlands, Norway, Portugal, Spain, and Sweden).

But on 21 December, nine new signatory nations implemented it (Czech Republic, Estonia, Hungary, Latvia, Lithuania, Malta, Poland, Slovakia, and Slovenia) along with one non-signatory nation (Monaco). Now, only Great Britain, Ireland, Cyprus, Romania, Bulgaria, and Switzerland among signatory countries remain outside. Switzerland and Liechtenstein will probably implement Schengen in 2008, and Vatican City has expressed interest in joining as well. Two days of celebrations marked this extension of Europe's passport-free zone, including prominent celebrations at Germany's borders with Poland and Czech Republic. It has now become possible to travel 2,500 miles (over 4,000 km), from Tallinn to Lisbon, without showing any passport.

Unsurprisingly, thousands of refugees from Russia and Balkan states have flowed into Central European countries like Poland, Hungary, and Slovenia hoping to take advantage of free access to western European countries. Those who will no longer be able to travel freely to those countries, like Serbs, resent their new isolation, fearing they have found themselves on wrong side of new Iron Curtain. But for most Europeans, this Schengen Zone expansion means old Cold War frontiers have finally gone for good, accounting for all that good feeling on all sides.

Next time some Latvian wants to visit Amsterdam, he can drive there and back without anyone demanding to see what he carries in his luggage. Compare that freedom to what Canadians flocking to United States to buy cheap groceries or Christmas gifts will experience on both sides of what used to be called world's longest peaceful border.

Tags: Europe, EU, written by novy, edited by Port1080 (all tags)

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1

Red Herring?

port1080.

Wed Dec 26, 2007 at 10:54:22 AM EST

4.00 (astute)

The Canada/US analogy isn't entirely fair. Both the US and Canada each, on their own, are approximately the same size as the EU member states in geographical size. This makes agreements like this much less imperative. While it's true that there are advantages to agreements like there, there are also many potential pitfalls (such as lost revenue from import tariffs, illegal immigration, easier human trafficking, easier movement of criminals across borders, and so on). These are somewhat ameliorated by the fact that the EU states already have many economic and security arrangements in place through the EU framework, but the US and Canada don't have those advantages. Perhaps they should pursue them (and I hope they do, Canada's a nice place to visit and the border areas on both sides can always use the extra economic stimulus from cross-border trade), but until they're in place it's not really valid to compare the status of EU internal borders to that of the US / Canadian border.

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Re: Red Herring?

novy.

Wed Dec 26, 2007 at 12:37:05 PM EST

4.00 (interesting)

US-Canada boundary shouldn't even exist. What was point of NAFTA agreement again? For pitiful sums of money that might be lost from import tariffs that shouldn't be levied anyway, for trickle of Mexicans that might make it to Fort McMurray if they didn't freeze to death en route, for all that human trafficking over Canadian-US boundary, and for all those criminal influxes, stimulation of economic growth on both sides of boundary ought to count for more.

I will go further though, in interests of controversy. US should just allow people from Canada, Australia, New Zealand, Ireland, and Britain to enter country without passport checks. What, US doesn't trust countries so similar to itself that almost everyone else in world thinks us all in league anyway? How many troops do Britain and Australia and Canada have to commit around world whenever US gets bug up its arse before we get treated like insiders? How many Americans had to escape from Iran in 1979 by pretending to be from Toronto, eh? How many Americans pretend to be Canadians when they travel in Europe these days? (George Bush? Oh, that guy. We all hate him up in Winnipeg.)

Most Americans can't tell difference between us and them anyway. How many of us live illegally in US and how few Americans care? At least we speak English, mollifying those who feel threatened by Spanish-speakers. Why bother to maintain border emplacements to keep out people who look just like you? Come on, admit it, most of you think we act and sound "cute". George Bush, tear down that customs post!  

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Not Gonna Happen

uncarved block.

Wed Dec 26, 2007 at 06:22:08 PM EST

4.00 (informative)

    Totally dropping the border up north? I've got one name for you: Diana Dean. (Check out the heavy MSM liberal bias in that report, too.) I can't think of more than a handful of politicians who would want to be on the wrong side of that issue.
    And the Brits? My god, man, they actually let real lives Socialists have a say in the government sometimes. How could you ever trust people like that?

Ex ignorantia ad sapientiam; e luce ad tenebras

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Re: Not Gonna Happen

novy.

Wed Dec 26, 2007 at 07:49:44 PM EST

none

Yes, and if we dropped border up north, Americans with guns would probably swamp Canadian cities, bringing out-of-control American crime with them. I see your point.

And the Brits? They were only country to send tens of thousands of troops to Iraq besides you! If they were that stupid, how could you trust them to enter your country?

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Re: Red Herring?

Jackkeefe.

Wed Dec 26, 2007 at 01:31:23 PM EST

2.50 (interesting)

How many Americans pretend to be Canadians when they travel in Europe these days
eorge Bush? Oh, that guy. We all hate him up in Winnipeg

That's been going on at least  since the mid 90's, when I first encountered it.  I think the willingness of some Americans to lie about their country of origin says more about the prejudices and closemindeness of Europeans more than anything else.  

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Re: Red Herring?

novy.

Wed Dec 26, 2007 at 02:05:31 PM EST

none

Perhaps European closed-mindedness explains Americans trying to pass as Canadians, but it doesn't explain Americans getting away with it. It works because differences between Americans and Canadians don't amount to hill of beans. That being so, why bother with tight controls on boundary that doesn't really matter to anyone and doesn't separate countries with significant social differences?

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Re: Red Herring?

Minos.

Thu Dec 27, 2007 at 05:49:24 PM EST

4.00 (funny)

As a Minnesotan visiting Europe, I actually had difficulty explaining to people that I wasn't Canadian.  I must be developing an accent.  (I grew up in Wisconsin, where people talk normal)

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Re: Red Herring?

novy.

Thu Dec 27, 2007 at 05:53:10 PM EST

none

Next time you can try various Caribbean islands where you would also have difficulty convincing anyone you were American, since so few actually visit certain islands. Maybe it was your peaceful countenance. Maybe Minnesotans and Wisconsinites really should be classified as Canadian.

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Re: Security, Security, Security

Jackkeefe.

Wed Dec 26, 2007 at 06:54:04 PM EST

3.00 (astute)

Fairly or not, Canada is viewed as having a very lax immigration policy that allows easy access to radical islamists. Before any such proposal could gain any headway, the specter of the millennium bomber would be plastered in the consciouness of American by the excitable media.  I can't see any administration taking the risk of opening the border because the political fallout would be disastrous if a successful terrorist entered the States through Canada.

I don't see any practical solution to concerns about Canadian border security.  I doubt Canada would allow America to dictate its immigration policy, and I don't see a consensus developing in America anytime soon that would allow for easier immigration into the country.

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Re: Security, Security, Security

novy.

Wed Dec 26, 2007 at 07:53:10 PM EST

none

Have you ever crossed US-Canada boundary? After waiting for some long period of time, you finally get to customs agent, who probably doesn't even ask your name, doesn't ask to see your ID or passport, asks what you plan to do in US, and then waves you through after you tell him you plan to shop at some US supermarket. So US maintains border posts so that it can stop Arabs? If so, then why not be upfront about what you do and let rest of us come and go at will?

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Re: Europe's Schengen Zone Expands

eduardo.

Wed Dec 26, 2007 at 01:12:04 PM EST

4.00 (funny)

I hate it ;)

Well, I don't exactly hate it but it's been an annoyance to me twice...

First, I really like to have stamps in my passport as reminders of places I've been to. This setup dramatically cuts down on that since you only get stamps at the first and last country you visit in Europe but not any you visit in the interrim. Ok, so this isn't a real big deal but it pissed me off when I realized this the first time.

Second, and this was more serious - I once was going from Paris to NYC via Amsterdam. There was something like 30 minutes between landing in Amsterdam and takeoff. I didn't consider the fact that Paris-Amsterdam was a 'domestic' flight, which meant that I had to go through passport control at Amsterdam to get into the international part of the terminal. The lines were huge and I barely got onto my NYC flight on time.

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Re: Europe's Schengen Zone Expands

novy.

Wed Dec 26, 2007 at 02:20:43 PM EST

none

Can you imagine someone coming to US and saying they hate that you can travel from New York to Chicago without passing through customs? Or that they didn't realise that Los Angeles-Seattle was "a domestic flight"? Your annoyance originated primarily in your unfamiliarity with Europe. Next time, buy coffee mugs or other crap gifts that say "France" or "Italy" on them, like you would buy things that said "Wyoming" on them if you visited Yellowstone.

I add that if you had 30 minutes from landing in Amsterdam and takeoff for New York but made your flight anyway, lines couldn't have been that "huge". Sit on two-hour line at Peace Arch sometime and then complain about Amsterdam.

Also, better to buy 3 gms of hashish in Amsterdam and then drive home to Paris or Madrid than to buy antibiotics in Vancouver and then try driving home to Berkeley. People in France and Germany must be much more open-minded than people in US who fear what their neighbours might bring back from Great White North.

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^ 6

Why drive

Lou.

Wed Dec 26, 2007 at 04:57:40 PM EST

3.00 (funny)

I get everything I need right in my mail box.  

Thanks, Canada Drug!

It's the end of the world as we know it, and I feel fine

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^ 8

Re: Why drive

novy.

Wed Dec 26, 2007 at 05:24:03 PM EST

none

For now, anyway. I hope you can always make that same statement.

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Re: Why drive

Lou.

Wed Dec 26, 2007 at 06:16:14 PM EST

none

My plan is to keep on using CD for my meds and thus not hang myself until such time I get a job with health insurance and finally acquire my drugs "legally".  Funny old country I live in, eh?

It's the end of the world as we know it, and I feel fine

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Re: Why drive

novy.

Wed Dec 26, 2007 at 07:44:35 PM EST

none

I hear you. And dental services come so much cheaper in Canada that it would almost justify visiting just to have your teeth worked on. Considering Canadian doctors have as much training as US ones, you could actually visit Canada for medical tourism purposes without having to fly 12 hours to Asia. US has best medical system on Earth, if you can afford it.

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^ 14

Re: Why drive

TonedEff.

Wed Dec 26, 2007 at 09:45:49 PM EST

3.00 (funny)

Yeah, but you just can't buy a nice working kidney in Saskatoon like you can in Manila.

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^ 17

Re: Why drive

novy.

Wed Dec 26, 2007 at 10:18:20 PM EST

none

But if you buy one from China, at least you can be reasonably sure it came from executed prisoner rather than from some desperate person who lost his kidney for financial reasons.

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^ 18

China Or Manila, What's The Difference?

TonedEff.

Thu Dec 27, 2007 at 08:33:18 AM EST

none

Either way it involves more than a quick trip across the border.

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Re: China Or Manila, What's The Difference?

novy.

Thu Dec 27, 2007 at 09:32:58 AM EST

none

Certainly true. Fortunately, most people only need root canal or cheap drugs.

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Re: Europe's Schengen Zone Expands

eduardo.

Wed Dec 26, 2007 at 03:52:50 PM EST

none

I wasn't -really- complaining, dude.

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Re: Europe's Schengen Zone Expands

novy.

Wed Dec 26, 2007 at 05:21:54 PM EST

4.00 (informative, funny)

Sorry, I still have problems with nuance and sarcasm.

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