Diary

Obama's Sista Souljah Moment?

port1080.

Posted to Diary on Fri Dec 19, 2008 at 11:32:42 AM EST. RSS.

The President-Elect has announced his choice to give the invocation at his inauguration - evangelical minister Rick Warren, opponent of gay marriage, supporter of the Iraq war, but also a relatively liberal evangelical, with a large following and cross-spectrum appeal.  A brilliant political move on Obama's part, no?  A symbolic choice that nonetheless makes him look inclusive and willing to listen to all voices, as he promised in his campaign.  Literally a coup, in terms of reaching out to a group (evangelicals) that Democrats have been desperately trying to get votes from for years.

Not so fast, say progressives.  Nevermind that Obama agrees with us on every matter of substance, that's not good enough.  Apparently only people who agree with the hard left wing of the party should be acknowledged as existing.  Whatever happened to the party of inclusiveness?  Agree to disagree?  It's disturbing, although not particularly shocking, how quickly the knives have come out.

That said, I think this is a brilliant move on Obama's part.  It lets him distance himself from the hard left wing of the party (which, frankly, he doesn't need anymore - where are they going to go, running back to Nader?), while giving him an opening to do the exact sort of reforms that they would want.  A president who is viewed as governing from the left would have a hard time putting in a leftist agenda - people would think that the policies were driven by ideology, rather than the pragmatic / "it's what works" approach that Obama promised in his campaign.  If the left is constantly bitching about Obama, though, it gives the impression that he's a centrist...and gives him that much more leeway to do what he wants in terms of policy.  It's brilliant, and a little scary - at least of now, Obama appears to be the most skilled politician to hold the office of the presidency since Nixon (not exactly an endorsement, eh?).  Of course, I could be reading this all wrong, and this might have just been a mistake on Obama's part and the beginning of a huge division between him and his base that will lead to disaster in the mid-term elections and a failed, one term presidency.  But I'm not betting on it.

Tags: (all tags)

This story: 33 comments (0 from subqueue)
Post a Comment
25

All is Forgiven

profwhat.

Tue Dec 23, 2008 at 12:41:01 AM EST

5.00 (funny)

Holy smokes -- the new president is a hottie!  I take it back -- anoint all the anti-gay evangelicals you want; just keep working out!

29

Hey

Lou.

Tue Dec 23, 2008 at 04:50:38 PM EST

5.00 (astute, comic)

Put a ponytail on Rick Warren and look at what you get.

Why does reduced fat Swiss cheese have twice as many holes are regular Swiss cheese?

4

the 'social control at any cost' movement

gerrymander.

Fri Dec 19, 2008 at 02:19:05 PM EST

4.50 (interesting)

I think the reactions from the Left regarding the past few days are telling:

Obama refuses to comment on what contact his staff has had with corrupt and disgraced Illinois Governor Blagojevich, preferring to release a report just before Christmas, from Hawaii, and no doubt issued as a single copy to be placed in a locked drawer in a disused basement behind a door marked "Beware of the Leopard": crickets.

Obama selects an evangelical pastor, who is reasonably socially liberal save for his support of California's Prop 8, to give the invocation at the inauguration: OMGWTFBBQ!!!1!One!

5

^ 4

Re: the 'social control at any cost' movement

DEMachina.

Fri Dec 19, 2008 at 05:09:50 PM EST

none

Obama refuses to comment on what contact his staff has had with corrupt and disgraced Illinois Governor Blagojevich, preferring to release a report just before Christmas, from Hawaii, and no doubt issued as a single copy to be placed in a locked drawer in a disused basement behind a door marked "Beware of the Leopard": crickets.

Think this might have something to do with the fact that Blagojevich is on tape being pissed at Obama because the latter refused to promise him kickbacks?

Now if only I could figure out why I keep having these images of men on horseback flash through my head....

Q: What do you think of western civilization? Gandhi: I think it would be a good idea.

6

^ 5

dig my grave

gerrymander.

Fri Dec 19, 2008 at 07:22:58 PM EST

4.00 (interesting)

Think this might have something to do with the fact that Blagojevich is on tape being pissed at Obama because the latter refused to promise him kickbacks?

I think you could shorten that to "the fact that Blagojevich is on tape". It would be perfectly normal and expected for an outgoing Senator and President-elect to express interest, personally or through staff, to his state's selection agency about a successor. What isn't normal (I hope) is the rampant corruption present in Illinois politics.

Whether or not Obama will personally be implicated in this scandal (which need not necessarily be the same as personal involvement in it), he will certainly be implicated for his staff selection -- and there are reports of at least two of them on the other end of the phone with Blago on the tapes. Couple that with Attorney General nominee Eric Holder's curious omission of the time he spent investigating corruption in Illinois for Blago (and finding none; how convenient), and you've got an incoming president who's already looking at a major scandal.

Most importantly, it's a scandal that increasingly looks like it'll be making headlines for a long, long time. Tony Rezko's sentence hearing has been postponed, and the working theory is that he's squeal..., uh, "cooperating". Blago just pulled a Nixon-level "I am not a crook" during today's press conference, and vowed to fight for his innocence. Since Blago's lawyer has already said he intends to challenge the legality of the wiretap, the FBI will be scrambling to find other ways to corroborate or otherwise bolster the eventual indictment -- and that means shaking down everybody even remotely connected.

Obama's already tried the "nothing to see here; move along" approach, but outside events overrode that ploy. I figure he's got one more chance to either opt for entrenchment behind obfuscation and annoyance (as per his candidacy script), or totally come clean. After that comes the long knives.

Either way, it's nice to know those crossed axes I've sent you for Christmas will be well-received.

13

^ 6

Re: dig my grave

the chtorr.

Sun Dec 21, 2008 at 02:52:01 PM EST

4.00 (vermicious)

You seem to take a certain amount of joy.  Maybe glee in saying that this could cause trouble for your incoming president.   Do you think that because of the existence of Governor Blagojevich that President Elect Obama should not have run?  Are you hoping that this causes your new president to fail even before he has begun?  It seems that he should fail speedily regardless of reason rather than so after a sober examination of his policies.

14

^ 13

Re: dig my grave

gerrymander.

Sun Dec 21, 2008 at 03:57:23 PM EST

3.20 (other, interesting, realistic)

You seem to take a certain amount of joy.  Maybe glee in saying that this could cause trouble for your incoming president.

Yeah, that's a fair assessment.

Do you think that because of the existence of Governor Blagojevich that President Elect Obama should not have run?

I think that, had the press done its job, Obama's candidacy would have ended in the primary season.

Are you hoping that this causes your new president to fail even before he has begun?

Well, he is the candidate of hope, after all.

30

^ 14

despite my harsh tone, i'm laughing with you

1fastdog.

Tue Dec 23, 2008 at 05:08:26 PM EST

5.00 (funny, entertaining)

I think that, had the press done its job, Obama's candidacy would have ended in the primary season.

I think what you're really saying here is that the GOP are a bunch fuckin' pussies, whom despite having a 24hr election cycle for two whole fucking years, a TV network dedicated to conservatism, a million blithering idiots on talk radio, and an army of douchebag bloggers looking under every rock in the country for that elusive footage of Obama, Ayers, and Rezko having a SATANIC threesome with MaCauley Caulkin, still couldn't dig up one iota of dirt on Obama, and are now reduced to the hilarious and yet-so-very-shrill position of faulting the media to do what they themselves were unable to pull off.  This is what it's come to for y'all on the right? Blaming the press just like those disgruntled, left-wing, anti-war protesters did that y'all hate so much. Sweet, delicious irony, that's fucking rich, man!

Somewhere in my soul, there's always Rock -n- Roll... Joe Strummer

31

^ 30

Re: despite my harsh tone, i'm laughing with you

gerrymander.

Tue Dec 23, 2008 at 05:32:32 PM EST

none

elusive footage of Obama, Ayers, and Rezko having a SATANIC threesome with MaCauley Caulkin

See? This is what I mean about disingenuous liberals -- that would be a Satanic foursome. ;-)

32

^ 31

Re: despite my harsh tone, i'm laughing with you

Lou.

Tue Dec 23, 2008 at 05:43:27 PM EST

none

Baby...if you can't Satanic with three you just ain't trying.

Why does reduced fat Swiss cheese have twice as many holes are regular Swiss cheese?

33

^ 31

aaiiieeeeeeee....

1fastdog.

Tue Dec 23, 2008 at 06:53:43 PM EST

none

Guilty as charged: Math Dumbass™, that's me!!

Somewhere in my soul, there's always Rock -n- Roll... Joe Strummer

15

^ 14

Re: dig my grave

the chtorr.

Sun Dec 21, 2008 at 05:20:05 PM EST

none

So you would like to see this president fail and put millions in deeper jeopardy simply because you are unhappy with the result of your elections?  And not fail because he is a bad president but fail because his administration is distracted by the actions of another?  Such pettiness is beneath you and diminishes you.

16

^ 15

Re: dig my grave

gerrymander.

Sun Dec 21, 2008 at 06:29:06 PM EST

4.00 (interesting)

So you would like to see this president fail and put millions in deeper jeopardy simply because you are unhappy with the result of your elections?  And not fail because he is a bad president but fail because his administration is distracted by the actions of another?

Reverse the causality chain of the first: I'm unhappy with the election result because I believe Obama will put millions in deeper jeopardy. As for the second, any scandal which makes it less likely that damaging legislation will be enacted is acceptable to me.

I would also claim that any distraction provided by Blagojevich is indicative of Obama being a bad president. He had total control over the people who are appointed to his staff, what steps were taken to isolate the President-elect from Illinois political corruption, and how the response to the press was handled. If Obama can't handle this, where almost everything is under his control, how will he manage an international crisis, where almost nothing will be?

17

^ 16

Re: dig my grave

Lou.

Sun Dec 21, 2008 at 06:58:50 PM EST

5.00 (cool)

Jeez Louise, Gerry.  Gettin' all altruistic on us?  Don't lie to the noob.  You could give a rat's ass about the festering millions.  You don't even care about folks who have to drive to another state or something just to get the meds some moralistic prig won't stock.  Admit it...yer getting a buzz off of the whole Blaggy thing.  Which of course will make watching the resulting buzzkill all the sweeter if Obama succeeds.  

Why does reduced fat Swiss cheese have twice as many holes are regular Swiss cheese?

24

^ 16

Re: dig my grave

the chtorr.

Mon Dec 22, 2008 at 10:36:51 PM EST

1.50 (judgmental, trumped)

There is nothing to reverse.  You expresed your glee before and in stronger terms than your logic.  You only expressed your thoughts logically when you were criticized.  Sadly petty smallness trumps fairness again.

1

Re: Obama's Sista Souljah Moment?

pO157.

Fri Dec 19, 2008 at 12:39:45 PM EST

none

Do we have to "Watch [her] crank it, watch her [roll]?" Because if so, you can count me out.

Lνstek, prosνm.

2

^ 1

Should have been

pO157.

Fri Dec 19, 2008 at 12:41:39 PM EST

5.00 (moist)

" Watch [her] crank it, watch [her] roll?"  

Then again, maybe we'd get higher ratings for the inauguration if everybody tuned in to see her "super soak dat ho." Usually you have to pay double for that type of action. Except for that random threesome I walked in on in college. Creepy guys get all the action. Darn.

Lνstek, prosνm.

3

Beating The Sophist King To The Mark.

MayorBob.

Fri Dec 19, 2008 at 12:47:23 PM EST

none

Obama transcends invocations.

Tending to final details.

7

Re: Strange

zyxwvutsr.

Fri Dec 19, 2008 at 08:18:08 PM EST

none

I've seen several news articles that claim Warren equates homosexuality with incest and bestiality, but I haven't seen a single one that attributed a full quote on the matter directly to him.

I wonder why that is. Has anyone seen an actual quote?

8

^ 7

Re: Strange

thefadd.

Fri Dec 19, 2008 at 10:19:26 PM EST

none

This is 30 seconds more than I care to spend on this subject but:

RW: But the issue to me is, I'm not opposed to that as much as I'm opposed to the redefinition of a 5,000-year definition of marriage. I'm opposed to having a brother and sister be together and call that marriage. I'm opposed to an older guy marrying a child and calling that a marriage. I'm opposed to one guy having multiple wives and calling that marriage.

Interviewer: Do you think, though, that they are equivalent to having gays getting married?

RW: Oh I do. ... Most people, you know... I have many gay friends, I've eaten dinner in gay homes, no church has probably done more for people with AIDS than Bareback Church. Kay and I have given millions of dollars out of "A Purpose-Driven Life" helping people who got AIDS through gay relationships. So they can't accuse me of homophobia. I just don't believe in the re-definition of marriage.

escalators never fail; they just become stairs

9

^ 8

Re: Strange

zyxwvutsr.

Fri Dec 19, 2008 at 10:35:08 PM EST

none

I missed the part about bestiality.

23

^ 9

Needing to read better

Lou.

Mon Dec 22, 2008 at 02:49:31 PM EST

5.00 (funny)

At first glance it looked like you said you missed bestiality.

Why does reduced fat Swiss cheese have twice as many holes are regular Swiss cheese?

10

^ 9

Re: Strange

thefadd.

Fri Dec 19, 2008 at 10:44:22 PM EST

none

My favorite among the parrotings is the one that made sure to highlight the point that Warren compared gay sex to bestiality and family-fucking, unfavorably.

escalators never fail; they just become stairs

11

^ 10

Re: Strange

zyxwvutsr.

Fri Dec 19, 2008 at 11:22:08 PM EST

none

My favorite part was about "gay homes."

12

^ 11

Re: Strange

thefadd.

Sat Dec 20, 2008 at 03:23:04 AM EST

4.00 (jolly)

My home is very gay but only at the holidays.

escalators never fail; they just become stairs

18

Obama and the gays

profwhat.

Sun Dec 21, 2008 at 08:30:52 PM EST

none

There are a lot of people who favor civil unions while opposing marriage.  Obama is one of them.  His reason for this untenable position is particularly disturbing: his religion compels the conclusion.  "My religious beliefs say that marriage is something sanctified between a man and a woman," he said during a 2004 debate.  So, it's not about procreation, or the interests of children, or any of the other plausible but incorrect arguments raised against gay marriage.  Obama opposes it because his religion tells him to.  This is a naked statement that he wants to translate his religious beliefs into public policy: not that they inform policy, but they dictate it.

Putting Rick Warren into perspective, it's just a prayer at an inauguration.  At least he didn't get that "God damn America" guy to do it.  But the choice of Rick Warren elevates him.  Before this, Rick Warren was one of a endless series of god-peddlers with self help books and a megachurch; they come, go, and flame out.  This invitation gives the guy legitimacy.

19

On Another Note

uncarved block.

Sun Dec 21, 2008 at 10:28:27 PM EST

none

    Christopher Hitchens, almost always amusing even when wrong, hits on a better reason to have skipped Warren at the inauguration: he's a "vulgar huckster" who associates with with bigots. (Remember that Hitchens has jumped on the "Islamic extremists are going to destroy the West" bandwagon, so prejudice against Jews is presumably on his mind frequently.) Now, while all this should matter if you believe religion poisons everything anyway isn't exactly clear to me- it's not as if this is more than a symbolic moment- but it is worth reflecting upon in light of the late attacks on Obama's connections to Reverend Wright. It's also makes me think that churches are the most private public places in America, and that there's a general conspiracy of silence not to discuss too openly what's preached there. Glass houses, and all that.
    As far as "the left" bitching about Warren . . well, that's just the downside of the general positive of having a lot of media access. There was a sizable minority of conservatives who soured on Bush very early, but outside the occasional Cato Institute speech, there just wasn't much they could do to get on major media programs. (It also would have interrupted the Grand Narrative, and led to a dreaded degree of complexity-- anathema to pundits and the like.) This will likely be the least of the progressive's complaints when it comes to Obama, but at least in this case Warren is tacky enough to bitch about: pulling some old Senate chaplain out of retirement for a day would have sufficed, or maybe some eminent Catholic bishop, or what have you.
    The Warren pick has the advantage of showing an at least symbolic desire to reach across the partisan and cultural divide, but I suspect that the other side of the gulf has zero interest in getting along, at least if gerrymander's posts are any indication. This may be the hardest lesson Obama has to learn in his first term . . .

Ex ignorantia ad sapientiam; e luce ad tenebras

20

^ 19

Re: On Another Note

zyxwvutsr.

Mon Dec 22, 2008 at 01:02:24 AM EST

3.00 (scientific, foggy)

I'm guessing that gays think gayness is more important than science; because Warren is as anti-science as any of the assholes that the Bush Administration latched on to.

Then again, Obama transcends science. So no worries...right?

21

^ 20

Huh?

uncarved block.

Mon Dec 22, 2008 at 10:37:32 AM EST

none

    I'm having trouble following you here.

Ex ignorantia ad sapientiam; e luce ad tenebras

22

^ 21

Re: Huh?

zyxwvutsr.

Mon Dec 22, 2008 at 12:00:03 PM EST

3.00 (funny, fogbound)

What, you were unaware that Warren is anti-science? Or were you unaware that Obama transcends science?

26

^ 22

Ella Gurus

uncarved block.

Tue Dec 23, 2008 at 02:09:42 PM EST

none

    Anti-science? Never thought about it much. I mean, wasn't Warren's schtick that he combined self help rhetoric with ministry? Because there's not a lot of pro-science talk in those circles, near as I can tell: Wayne Dyer with his messages from the universe, Deepak Chopra with what looks to be rehashed Hinduism, Don Miguel Ruiz with his "ancient Toltec wisdom", and so on and so forth. Combining evangelism with this happy talk didn't seem like a recipe for Stephen Gould like love for science.

    If your goal was to mock a slogan, then by all means carry on. Slogans deserve to be mocked, successful ones more than the rest. I just didn't see any connection between your post and mine, that's all.

Ex ignorantia ad sapientiam; e luce ad tenebras

27

^ 26

Re: Ella Gurus

zyxwvutsr.

Tue Dec 23, 2008 at 02:21:59 PM EST

5.00 (gay)

Anti-science?
Specifically, Warren doesn't believe in evolution. Maybe Obama could have found a minister who does, but maybe not. I dunno.

If your goal was to mock a slogan, then by all means carry on
What slogan?

I just didn't see any connection between your post and mine, that's all
You wrote that the left was bitching about Warren. The only bitching I heard had to do with him being anti-gay; no one seems to care much that he's anti-science. That leads me to wonder if "the left" cares more about gayness than about science. I think they probably do, by and large. (People on the left are not terribly fond of science unless it's the sort of science that fits into their ideology.)

28

^ 27

Evolving Standards

uncarved block.

Tue Dec 23, 2008 at 02:43:43 PM EST

none

     Well, the scandal du jour is over gay marriage, but a quick Google found at least a couple recent hits pointing out that Warren doesn't believe in evolution, including a Nation article and a snippet from Paul Krugman. Whether that's enough for you, I don't know, and don't much feel like pursuing any further. Warren did debate Sam Harris last April, and there was possibly a little buzz about it back then.

    Could Obama have found a minister, preacher, pastor, what have you, that believes in evolution? Certainly. But it wouldn't have made a splash, which is something he seems to want to do on many fronts.

Ex ignorantia ad sapientiam; e luce ad tenebras

This story: 33 comments (0 from subqueue)
Post a Comment