Politics

Berkeley Seeks To Cut Off All Escape Routes For Conservatives

pO157.

Posted to Politics on Mon Feb 11, 2008 at 12:46:59 PM EST (promoted by port1080). RSS.

Famously liberal Berkeley, California has told the United States Marine Corps recruitment staff that they are not welcome in their city.

The trouble started when the Berkeley city council decided to pass resolutions aimed at driving the only Marine Corps recruiting station from the city. The resolutions encouraged people to nonviolently "impede passively, actively" the recruitment activities of the USMC. It also refers to the Marines as "uninvited and unwelcome intruders" and instructs the city manager to tell the Commandant of the Marine Corps that his organization is "not welcome in our city." Protest organizer Zanna Joi said their group wanted to inform people that "If you're going to join the Marines, you're going to join the Marines. But you don't have to join the Marines from our town."

While the weekly protests outside the recruitment office have been getting larger, the Marines are taking a passive approach. They send the staff home and shut the blinds during the afternoons when Code Pink and anti-war demonstrators show up. At a recent rally the only counterprotester, USMC Staff Sgt (ret) Bill Hamilton, said he believes Code Pink have it all wrong and don't realize why the office is there.

 "They don't seem to realize that this recruiting office is only for recruiting potential officers with college degrees, not kids right out of high school. Marines are willing to die so these people can have their say, but I wish they understood the situation better."

The council recently sided with war protest group Code Pink by giving them dedicated parking spaces outside the recruitment office, and granting them permits for excessive sound for a once a week protest.

After several republican senators began to work at pulling federal grant money from the city, UC Berkley and school lunch programs and then redirecting it to the Marine Corps the city rethought their stance. One of the council people apologized and called for a more moderating resolution:

"Subtly stated in the resolution is perhaps an impugning of the soldiers fighting for us in Iraq and other places. And that was never the intention but that really needs to be cleared up. As I walked to my car that night I realized I regretted it and I had made a mistake."

Except for excessive noise bothering neighbors and businesses, the protests have been mostly peaceful except for when activists were arrested for chaining themselves to the building to prevent people from entering to ask about signing up.

Tags: edited by Port1080, written by pO157, R. Lee Ermey, Vincent D'Onofrio, Mickey Mouse shit, Officer Selection Board, Code Pink, Code Blue, Code Red, USMC, Marines, Military, War, Iraq, Bush, Berkeley, California, Designated Parking Space, First Amendment, Shrill Rantings (all tags)

This story: 22 comments (9 from subqueue)
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18

Serious reasons to protest recent recruiting

postillion.

Tue Feb 12, 2008 at 10:53:01 PM EST

5.00 (informative)

As usual, the reason why Berkley's take on national politics is the lack of cohesive thinking.  

They share one trait with their nemesis the president: fuzzy thinking.

If Berkley wants to protest the war, protest the war.

But if they want to protest the recruitment into the Marines, there won't be any logic found in their over-dramatized prose nor any semblance to reality.

However, that said, there are serious reasons to be worried about U.S. military recruitment tactics.  The most serious is their recent practise of waiving criminal records, including felonies.

Another is the general downturn in standards as the military finds it harder to harder to recruit for an unpopular war. There's been a spike since the Iraq war began of falsifications of records by the military's recruiting officers.

I tried to link the two articles talking about these two problems, but I am hideously bad at tech things, so I offer the links straight out (sorry it's so ugly):
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/02/14/us/14military.html?_r=1&hp&ex=1171429200&en=c0cc079ae8 7389d4&ei=5094&partner=homepage&oref=slogin
http://www.nytimes.com/2005/03/27/nyregion/27recruit.html?pagewanted=4

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^ 18

Re: Serious reasons to protest recent recruiting

profwhat.

Wed Feb 13, 2008 at 06:45:45 PM EST

none

Ironically, shutting the US military off from recruiting Berkeley students will just make those situations worse.  Students at elite schools like Berkeley are, um, less likely to have committed felonies, or to have records that require falsification.

22

^ 21

Re: Serious reasons to protest recent recruiting

thefadd.

Thu Feb 14, 2008 at 08:32:31 PM EST

none

Or, you know, be more responsible military leadership. Those Berkeleyites should be pushing for everyone they can get from their ranks to infiltrate.

It is easy to buy small plaster models of what you think life is like.

11

at least its a protest eh?

wetkarma.

Tue Feb 12, 2008 at 05:44:37 AM EST

4.50 (interesting, interesting)

When the concept of civil disobedience was proposed - one key element was to be prepared to accept the consequences of breaking the law. You protest and you peacefully go to jail.

Somewhere along the way the way the "go to jail" part got dropped by modern protesters. The result has been violent action by some protestors at conferences like the G8, world economic forum etc. People have used the perceived anonymity of crows to act out their anarchistic fantasies. Destroying the plate glass of a starbucks store and burning a few SUV's shows the man...well shows him something!

Now you have activist groups seeking permits from the government, and in this particular case allied with local government to protest government foreign policy - in a location which has virtually no control over said policy. The level of emasculation and south-park level planning necessary to achieve this is stunning.

Why not protest outside Rep. Barbara Lee's office? Surely she as the federal representative in congress has far more control over what the marine's are doing than the local recruiting center? If the city and Code Pink wants to take a stand against the federal government why not target Rep. Nancy Pelosi who coincidentally has offices nearby as well?

Moreoever -- why target the marines and not the army? Surely the army has a greater military presence in Iraq?

I'm not such much disappointed that people are protesting the Iraq War, but that the protest is so weak and misdirected.  

Memory is a strange bell, jubilee and knell.

14

^ 11

Civil disobedience

profwhat.

Tue Feb 12, 2008 at 09:37:59 AM EST

5.00

What bothers me about the perversion of modern "civil disobedience" is that protesters are breaking laws that are totally unrelated to their protests.  Let's go back to what Martin Luther King Jr. had to say about this:

You express a great deal of anxiety over our willingness to break laws. This is certainly a legitimate concern. Since we so diligently urge people to obey the Supreme Court's decision of 1954 outlawing segregation in the public schools, at first glance it may seem rather paradoxical for us consciously to break laws. One may well ask: "How can you advocate breaking some laws and obeying others?" The answer lies in the fact that there are two types of laws: just and unjust. I would be the first to advocate obeying just laws. One has not only a legal but a moral responsibility to obey just laws. Conversely, one has a moral responsibility to disobey unjust laws. I would agree with St. Augustine that "an unjust law is no law at all."
So, while it is morally justifiable to break "unjust laws" as a means of civil disobedience--sitting at segregated lunch counters, making salt, whatever--doing things like blocking traffic and vandalizing Starbucks is unjustifiable, unless you are for some reason protesting traffic laws or the existence of Starbucks.

I can't for the life of me understand how modern protest movements lost sight of this rule so completely.

17

^ 11

Re: at least its a protest eh?

PenitenziAgite.

Tue Feb 12, 2008 at 10:30:25 PM EST

5.00 (interesting)

It's somewhat reminiscent of the Vietnam-era train blocking protests.  Students sat on the train tracks of the troop trains as they attempted to pass through Oakland.  The trains had to stop, the students got their heads dented in by amped-up cops, and the point was really made, and it had the added bonus of (temporarily) interrupting the war machine.

These protests, unfortunately, will have no effect.  It's not as though the Marine Corps is going to cease recruiting because their Berkeley office is shut.  There's an all-forces recruiting center in Oakland, about three blocks from a BART station.  Anyone who wants to join up can.  

I suggest that Code Pink direct their protests toward the Marine Corps detachment in Alameda.  They could also try Travis AFB.  

Better yet, Code Pink could try moving their activities to a place where they won't be preaching to the choir. It doesn't take a lot of courage to protest the Iraq war in Oakland/Berkeley.

Besides, how many Berkeleyites are they gonna recruit, anyway?  Do they tell prospective recruits that they can work on the giant hemp farm run by the Marines near Camp Pendleton?

sierra tango foxtrot uniform

13

^ 11

Re: at least its a protest eh?

zyxwvutsr.

Tue Feb 12, 2008 at 07:25:23 AM EST

4.00 (funny)

Why not protest outside Rep. Barbara Lee's office? Surely she as the federal representative in congress has far more control over what the marine's are doing than the local recruiting center? If the city and Code Pink wants to take a stand against the federal government why not target Rep. Nancy Pelosi who coincidentally has offices nearby as well?
The answer is so blatantly obvious that I have to ask whether you're posing a rhetorical question?

15

^ 11

Re: at least its a protest eh?

thefadd.

Tue Feb 12, 2008 at 02:44:55 PM EST

4.00 (funny)

I'm not sure what the upside of your argument really is. We should crack down harder on protesters to make it more satisfying for them and arrest them in order to help focus their efforts?

It is easy to buy small plaster models of what you think life is like.

16

^ 15

Re: at least its a protest eh?

wetkarma.

Tue Feb 12, 2008 at 05:12:54 PM EST

none

I'm not a big joiner or inclined to participate in group dynamics. However were I to engage in group protests, I'd strive for a semblance of effectiveness, rationality and elan.

In short, my problem with these protests is that they lack style. Whether from a deficit of imagination or simple laziness, these protests seem calculated to invoke minimal effort (parking passes?) for minimal real impact.

Alternate protest solutions for Code Pink were I a member:

  1. Organize a monthly formal wear march (everyone could wear a pink tie/scarf) from city hall to the offices of Nancy Pelosi demanding a cessation to the war. No violence, no street theater just  well dressed (i.e. serious) people  demanding change. I call this the MLK approach.

  2. Organize an anti-war blood-drive for the Red Cross in a press friendly location. Use emotion affecting propaganda phots in blown up stills at the event. I call this the Gandhi approach.

The point of protest dynamics is to sway hearts and minds. No one at the marine office is going to appreciate what Code Pink is doing. However if you engage the government without making the wider populace thing you are rabid nutballs you use shame as a weapon of non-violent change.

Considering however that by most peoples definition I'm actually pro the Iraq war, and as noted disinclined to group action.  I won't be protesting anytime soon. Were I to actually protest my version would be along the lines of Owen Meany than MLK or Gandhi.

Memory is a strange bell, jubilee and knell.

12

^ 11

Re: at least its a protest eh?

pO157.

Tue Feb 12, 2008 at 06:36:58 AM EST

none

When the concept of civil disobedience was proposed - one key element was to be prepared to accept the consequences of breaking the law. You protest and you peacefully go to jail.

Somewhere along the way the way the "go to jail" part got dropped by modern protesters. The result has been violent action by some protestors at conferences like the G8, world economic forum etc. People have used the perceived anonymity of crows to act out their anarchistic fantasies. Destroying the plate glass of a starbucks store and burning a few SUV's shows the man...well shows him something!

Now you have activist groups seeking permits from the government, and in this particular case allied with local government to protest government foreign policy - in a location which has virtually no control over said policy. The level of emasculation and south-park level planning necessary to achieve this is stunning.

Protest should not require permits at all as long as they are on public land such as sidewalks and parks and do not impede the normal flow of business (protest parades using city streets are a different matter). I cannot believe this has never been ruled to be unconstitutional.

Why not protest outside Rep. Barbara Lee's office? Surely she as the federal representative in congress has far more control over what the marine's are doing than the local recruiting center? If the city and Code Pink wants to take a stand against the federal government why not target Rep. Nancy Pelosi who coincidentally has offices nearby as well?

Because that wouldn't garner them the attention that acting like idiots outside a USMC building does. Every weekend a group of people here in my fair city gathers at a park by a major road crossroads and protests the war. Nobody bothers them, and nobody acts like idiots. Everybody wins. Of course, that means their message gets out but they necessarily don't get to get in the papers and act all tough.

Moreoever -- why target the marines and not the army? Surely the army has a greater military presence in Iraq?

I'm not such much disappointed that people are protesting the Iraq War, but that the protest is so weak and misdirected.  

Because they want to look tough? "ZOMG! We totally r0x0r3d the USMC! Did you see Gunnery Sgt. Hartman? He couldn't even show up to work to face us! He was too chicken to face our flamboyant outfits, shrill rantings and bullhorns. He had to respond via a.... chuckle Invited Op-Ed Column! What a tool! Yeah, we totally p0wn3d the man. All of the officer selectees that had appointments had to reschedule for... the next day! LOL LOL LOL"

I still believe these groups don't understand the amount of damage they do for the greater anti-war cause. Almost every protest I have driven by has had at least half the cars honk their horns, give a thumbs up, whatever. Much of the responses from bystanders or neighbors in the article seem to be questioning whether they had to block traffic in a congested commercial area for an entire afternoon and bother people with the noise.

1

Berkeley did too much LDS back in the '70s.

pO157.

Mon Feb 11, 2008 at 01:32:45 PM EST

4.00 (funny)

First off, what a bunch of idiots. I could almost respect the city position if they had said "We are against the war, and even though this office is mostly clerical in nature for recruiting officer selectees we are still against the war in any way shape or form. Therefore, we surrender all federal money and take whatever punishment from the Federal and state level is handed out to make a point." That is a true non-violent protest, akin to true heroes like Gandhi or Dr. King. Did they do that? No. They pulled some weak-ass grade school shenanigans and once the government contemplated a response that would hit them in the wallet they cried. Come on.

Second, what in the world is up with Code Pink? I agree to an extent with the words of the Marine officer in charge of recruitment in that area. He didn't authorize the war, he is just doing his job, and frankly, that office has no control over foreign policy. If Code Pink really has a problem with the war, they can pull their juvenile shenanigans outside the offices or home of their local representatives, Senator, or take the dog and pony show on the road to DC and chill outside the White House. Don't go acting like jackasses in front of a military office where the only people involved are educated folks who know what they are getting into (not the high school kids Code Pink claims to want to protect). Also, is anybody else here uncomfortable with the city granting Code Pink designated parking rights in front of that office? Wouldn't that open up a 14th amendment claim of equal protection clause for anti-abortionists or another group that Berkeley would likely detest to demanding reserved parking in front of a protest site of their choice? What a bunch of short sighted morons.

Also, does Code Pink, et al, really have to be so obnoxious in their protests? Could their actions actually be hurting the anti-war movement in a broader sense? Everybody ripped on Ron Paul for his fervent supporters for posting signs all over the place and being active, so imagine what people who watch their protests feel about the peace movement now? Finally both Berkeley and Code Pink give the anti-war movement a bad name.

That is all.

3

^ 1

Re: Berkeley did too much LDS back in the '70s.

PenitenziAgite.

Mon Feb 11, 2008 at 01:54:31 PM EST

5.00 (funny, funny, funny)

Too much LDS?  The intersection between the counterculture of the 60's and total squareness of Mormons is bound to cause all kinds of strange side-effects...

sierra tango foxtrot uniform

2

^ 1

Re: Berkeley did too much LDS back in the '70s.

shane.

Mon Feb 11, 2008 at 01:37:11 PM EST

4.00 (informative)

Gandhi hit the government in the pocketbook, not the other way around.  

5

^ 1

Re: Berkeley did too much LDS back in the '70s.

novy.

Mon Feb 11, 2008 at 02:14:30 PM EST

4.00 (interesting)

I didn't realise Berkeley had so many Mormons during 1970s.

Or did you mean to suggest that residents of city did too much LSD in 1970s and therefore residents of city in 2008 still experience municipal hallucinations?

When US went to war against Iraq, most people did nothing, even those who opposed it vehemently. Unlike during Vietnam War, almost no one has caught public's attention with any anti-war messages in ensuing years. This protest in Berkeley, as foolish as it seems to you and as counterproductive as it feels to you, did catch attention of people all around North America. Maybe it had more value than you would have thought at first glance.    

6

^ 5

Re: Berkeley did too much LDS back in the '70s.

pO157.

Mon Feb 11, 2008 at 02:31:05 PM EST

none

I didn't realise Berkeley had so many Mormons during 1970s.

Or did you mean to suggest that residents of city did too much LSD in 1970s and therefore residents of city in 2008 still experience municipal hallucinations?

It was a reference to a classic quote from the Star Trek movie series in which they visit Berkeley due to the wonders of time travel.

I kind of bungled it. Sorry.

When US went to war against Iraq, most people did nothing, even those who opposed it vehemently. Unlike during Vietnam War, almost no one has caught public's attention with any anti-war messages in ensuing years. This protest in Berkeley, as foolish as it seems to you and as counterproductive as it feels to you, did catch attention of people all around North America. Maybe it had more value than you would have thought at first glance.  

I wrote letters to my reps, and spoke about it to other people to encourage them to do so. I have friends that participated in non-disruptive protests. I think showing up outside a recruiting center to be loud and obnoxious gives the Other Side a chance to typecast the anti-war movement as people who simply like to be disruptive and cannot present their ideas in a rational manner. How much mileage do you think Fox News and Limbaugh got out of this? Do you think it outweighed any positive attention?

I agree with their general message, just not how they presented it.

8

^ 6

Re: Berkeley did too much LDS back in the '70s.

thefadd.

Mon Feb 11, 2008 at 03:07:24 PM EST

none

How much mileage do you think Fox News and Limbaugh got out of this?

None.

Do you think it outweighed any positive attention?

No.

It is easy to buy small plaster models of what you think life is like.

9

^ 8

Re: Berkeley did too much LDS back in the '70s.

pO157.

Mon Feb 11, 2008 at 03:14:31 PM EST

none

None.

Some.

10

^ 9

Re: Berkeley did too much LDS back in the '70s.

novy.

Mon Feb 11, 2008 at 03:19:34 PM EST

4.00 (interesting)

Not enough to get anyone they like nominated by Republican Party to run for US President. Even though I don't especially want to see John McCain as next US President, I admit I have been enjoying watching fundamentalist Christians and right-wing "conservatives" twist in wind. Would President McCain nominate someone like Alito or Roberts to Supreme Court or would he nominate someone approved by his best buddy Joe Lieberman? Wouldn't they like to know.  

7

^ 1

Re: Berkeley did too much LDS back in the '70s.

zyxwvutsr.

Mon Feb 11, 2008 at 02:42:15 PM EST

2.00 (obnoxious, obnoxious, obnoxious)

Also, does Code Pink, et al, really have to be so obnoxious in their protests?
They're liberals. What did you expect - calm, reasoned discussion?

Finally both Berkeley and Code Pink give the anti-war movement a bad name
What anti-war movement have you been seeing?

4

Re: Berkeley Seeks To Cut Off All Escape Routes Fo

PenitenziAgite.

Mon Feb 11, 2008 at 02:01:04 PM EST

4.00 (interesting, interesting)

Do those idiotic senators know that UC Berkeley just happens to be located in Berkeley, and that the city of Berkeley is a separate entity, and that cutting off grant funding for UC Berkeley will only hurt students at UCB?  Do they know that John "Dr. Yes" Yoo teaches at Boalt Hall?

That being said, I have lived in the East Bay nearly all my life, and while Berkeley enjoys this freethinking reputation, I have never encountered more self-satisfied, pontificating, know-it-all, lecture-me-on-how-to-live-my-life assholes than in Berkeley.  Underneath all that hair and patchouli - assholes.

sierra tango foxtrot uniform

19

Dirty Fucking Hippies

WMK.

Wed Feb 13, 2008 at 10:09:13 AM EST

none

I believe these sanctimonious flamboyant left-coast dumb-asses do the endless-war-for-profit machine a HUGE favor with their 'protest'.  They make themselves out to be such incredibly stupid idiots that they inspire nothing but widespread contempt and derision from just about anyone who is not a self-righteous pothead asshole.  Thanks a lot Berkley - all you have shown us that your town has enough concentrated fruit-loops in it to force your local government to embarrass all of you with this shit - you haven't done the anti-war effort any good.

Serious people can't take this pathetic example of 'protest' seriously so these tie-dye and giant-puppet-on-a-unicycle morons serve as a very uncomfortable reminder that the term 'loony-left' is sometimes a very appropriate label.  I hate this fucking war, I hate this evil torture loving government, I hate that I am surrounded by people who want to consume a bunch of ridiculous 'American Exceptionalism' fiction about what is going on in the world rather than face any ugly truths about what violence for profit has gone on and continues to go on while Americans avoid giving a shit about anything just as long as they can anesthetize themselves with consumer comfort like mythological lotus eaters.

A bunch of Berkley hippie side show freaks are not the antidote to the massive pageant of evil that has been unfolding and continues to unfold.  The United States Marines are not the problem.  The problem is each and every one of us who is awake  who doesn't try each day to nudge someone else out of their lotus eating dream.  It is a discouraging  and thankless task almost guaranteed to engender massive depression in anyone who attempts it, the truth is really that awful and the odds of making any difference are very, very low.

Crapping on the USMC only offends those whom you need to communicate with and by association makes it harder for 'normal' people opposed to the war to be heard.

"...when theft and high crime becomes obscenely obvious to even the blindest beer sucking idiot, it is always the Republicans who are in office." -- Joe Bageant

20

^ 19

Re: Dirty Fucking Hippies

thefadd.

Wed Feb 13, 2008 at 02:25:04 PM EST

none

keep the faith, brother

It is easy to buy small plaster models of what you think life is like.

This story: 22 comments (9 from subqueue)
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